This autoimmune hemolytic anemia doesn't show up

in regular bloodwork

The autoimmune hemolytic anemia from 2-butoxyethanol poisoning doesn't show up as you would expect. This is really a mystery. Everything can look OK in the initial tests: CBC, WBC, PTL, Hemoglobin and Hematocrit ... just a borderline normal RBC

And even when all the red blood cells must be premature, and there is a trace of blood in the urine ... still enough of the results for all being ok

One man wasn't even making enough red blood cells per 'retic ratio' 15 years after exposure ... yet still other tests are saying he is OK   -  A mystery!

            Details here healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?p=1170909#post1170909

do a 'retic ratio?'
It is part of the hemotology tests, if they order it

What was the count for the red blood cells?
Just at borderline normal or slightly under normal?

Was there any blood showing up in urine (protein ?) ... even trace?

One of the workers exposed to 2-butoxyethanol 15 years ago has a retic ratio of 0.3 % & the normal range is 0.5 - 2.0%

What does this mean?

Other counts looking mostly good:

WBC 6.3 (normal range for a male is 4.5-10.8)
RBC 4.45 (normal range for a male is 4.5-6.0)
HGB 14.0 (normal range for a male is 13-18)
HCT 43.1 (normal range for a male is 40-50)
PLT 216 (normal range is 150-450)

He has very, very low blood pressure (wonder what the volume of blood is?) There is concern for liver, and he has had rapid weight loss; he has collapsed a couple of times. This lower than normal level of 'retric' could be from lack of nutrition, so I don't think we can tell what was happening with the blood now that other ailments are getting severe. Or, is he just not making enough blood? What other tests are needed?

He also says he can only sleep about 15 minutes at night; he can't keep any moisture in his skin; his temper is always going off ... he is at his wits end. One time after he had collapsed they put him on a special heart machine and found the 3 of his heart chambers were double their normal size. These are also said to have thick, dark blood (Thick from fagility of red blood cells? Dark from lack of oxygen, most likely)

What other tests would be necessary to see if autoimmune hemolytic anemia is going on?
Positive Coombs' test, direct or indirect
Elevated bilirubin levels
Elevated LDH
Low serum haptoglobin
Hemoglobin in the urine
Elevated absolute reticulocyte count
Why is the test done: Elevated absolute reticulocyte count
To determine if red blood cells are being created in the bone marrow at an appropriate rate.
A special stain can be used to identify reticulocytes, because they contain remnants of RNA. Fully mature red blood cells are terminally-differentiated cells lacking nuclei and nucleic acids. The number of reticulocytes in the blood is proportional to their rate of synthesis and release by the bone marrow. The body will respond to bleeding or hemolytic anemia (breakdown of red blood cells) by an increased rate of red blood cell synthesis under normal circumstances. A lower-than-normal percentage of reticulocyte is suggestive of a nutritional deficiency. (However not in this case; bone marrow & immune system has been working overtime, & it is getting harder to make enough red blood cells or immune cells either?)


Low red blood cell count and hemoglobin

 

This man has had blood showing up in his urine regularly, too)

What did the CBC with differentials show? I think this is part of what is tested for, too?

The differential count estimates the number of the various types of WBCs. This can help detect infection, anemia, and leukemia; or follow the progress of treatment.


There are various types of WBCs (also called leukocytes) that normally appear in the blood. The differential determines the relative percentages of the different types of cells in the blood, notes any abnormal appearance of the cells, and the presence of any abnormal immature cells.

Neutrophils are mainly phagocytic cells (that is, they engulf and destroy invading organisms). They also release some enzymes and substances that affect the function of other cells called cytokines.
B lymphocytes (B cells) synthesize and secrete antibodies.
T lymphocytes (T cells) -- one type of T cell is called a helper cell; it secretes proteins that increase B cell function and the functions of cytotoxic T lymphocytes. Cytotoxic T lymphocytes recognize and destroy virus-infected and other abnormal cells.
Monocytes recognize a variety of microorganisms, especially gram-negative bacteria. Activated monocytes turn into macrophages that can engulf and destroy microorganisms and secrete a variety of cytokines that modulate the activity of other leukocytes.
Eosinophils and basophils release substances that cause vasoconstriction, smooth muscle contraction, and an increased permeability of small blood vessels. Eosinophils are stimulated by parasites and some bacteria. Basophils are stimulated by allergens.

 

What Slim has to share - in his own words - an EVOS worker
 
As far as I know he doesn't have a diagnosis of hemolysis or hemolytic anemia. (But it should be there ... hiding out)

Re: This autoimmune hemolytic anemia doesn't show up in regular bloodwork

My mother died from autoimmune hemolytic anemia almost 30 yrs ago. If what I'm told is right, not much was known about it then, and it went undiagnosed. She was admitted to the hospital and 4 days later she died. I understand people don't normally die from this. I was told she was given too many blood transfusions too fast and that lead to her death.

I looked up a few websites on this, but most were so technical I could not understand them. What is it caused from? Anyone know? Offdahook4now

When did your mom feel fatigue? Thank you for caring enough to want to know more. The chemical, 2-butoxyethanol also is known as ethylene glycol monobutyl ether and I suspect people in the early 1940's and before could have been harmed by it.

It was invented by the chemical companies in the 1930s

What did your mom do? Or more precisely, what was she doing the day she felt a horrible fatigue hit ... with flu-like symptoms and usually other symptoms like grouchiness & glandular problems and headaches can start up shortly thereafter. Even concern for liver and kidney function, etc.

I did have a lady share with me that her father had something similar and that they have to warm the blood and give it slowly over an 8 hour period. Two other transfusions not done this way failed, and a 3rd time of that would have killed him.

‘Dear Maggie’

My mother was a housewife. She had a severe case of anemia when she gave birth to my oldest sister and would have died if it were not for the blood transfusions she was given then.

She had very bad allergies and took shots for them. She often complained of headaches. She said she saw an aura before getting them and that it felt like someone was beating her over the head with a hammer.

She had been seeing a dr for her flu like symptoms for a month or more. The day she was rushed to the hospital she was very jaundiced and if I was told right, she was vomiting blood. She was only 41 yrs old.

I have all of her medical records. She did get better on the 2nd day of her hospitalization and told us she was coming home. I guess the effects of the blood transfusions (giving them too fast) hit her on the 6th day. She went into cardiac arrest four times, but the last time was the end for her.

I have always wanted to know more about this, but have never found anyone who knew anything about it. Thank you for your interest.  Offdahook4now

look through this info, please   - On this thread I share a lot of information with a gulf war vet as to what the symptoms are, etc.    Please read through this

If she had flu-like symptoms for a month + it is most likely that whatever cleaning product she was using ... or maybe she was doing a painting project or something ... was continually re-exposing her to the chemical 2-butoxyethanol.

She had several symptoms, so check to see if there was blood showing up in her urine and if there was a 'retic' ratio taken (reticulocyte count) which will only reveal too high early on ... or too low, much later on.

healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?p=1170909#post1170909
Read through pages 7-10 of this thread

The Walter Reid Army Medical Center said that hemolytic anemia was very rare. I suggest it is as common as CFS, CFIDS, and 'gulf war syndrome' plus the many, many others that have the symptoms but not the official diagnosis.

When someone is chemically poisoned by a chemical such as 2-butoxyethanol, some tests do not read right. In particular, there are too many immature red blood cells and many other tests are not reading OK, including the one which would indicate blood anemia.  ‘Dear Maggie’

healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?p=1217131&posted=1#post1217131

ragereport.com/phpbb/nfphpbb/viewtopic.php?p=17175#17175

healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?p=1218333#post1218333

 

  6#  
I will get her medical records out and look at them. I do know that her urine was a dark brown color, and I also read in the reports that it was thick, almost jelly like. I do not know if that was before she was admitted to the hospital or after. I'll look at the records. We were also told at the time (1975) that this was a very rare disease.

I thought I read somewhere about steriods possibly having something to do with this. That is why I mentioned the allergy shots.

My grandfather, her father, has always had a problem with low platletts and I wonder if this has anything to do with her?

By the way, I read the posts on the Gulf War syndrome. My husband is also a GW vet and is suffering from symptoms.

And I appreciate the time you're taking to explain or help me to understand this. I have had so many unanswered questions throughout the years about this.

 
 
Blood draws are said to be thick and dark    #7
When did her urine start showing up dark like this? For it to be thick like jelly at the time of admission to the hospital, it means that there was an immense amount of red blood cells being prematurely destroyed by her immune system, poor dear. Whatever was the exposure for her, she had no idea what it was ... nor did the medical profession, most likely ... or so that has been the case as to this chemical's exposure, that is for sure!

Many times at time of blood draws, the lab tech will notice that these have blood that is thicker and darker than normal. (Dark because there isn't enough oxygen in the blood... not enough mature red blood cells)

Many people can go back to the very day of their exposure to 2-butoxyethanol based on a combination of flu-like symptoms, fatigue, dark urine and eyes watering and burning?

Just wondering ... were you born before or after your mother's fatigue?

I would also note any urinalysis that your mom had. They may not have checked some stuff on red blood cells like 'retic' ratio ... but hopefully they did. Maybe you can help shed some light on this, too

I suspect your husband to be harmed by the same chemical. What does his urinalysis say?
  
09-15-2004
offdahook4now  
 
 #8
Here is some of her medical records. This is just a small bit of it. To answer your question, I was born in 1965. My mom was born in 1934 and died 1975. She was tired a lot due to her anemia.

I apologize for the length of this but maybe you can tell me what it means.

Thanks!!

This lady presented to the ER with a hemoglobin of apx. 5. A diagnosis of Coombs. positive, autoimmune hemolytic anemia was made. The patient was started on Prednisone 100 mgs daily with an extremely poor response. Apparently the hemoglobin got down to apx 3. At this point, it was felt that blookd transfusions were nec. despite the hazards involved. The patient was transfused. Today she was transferred to ICU and further transfusions were carried out. The patient developed repertory arrest, cardaic arrest associated with massive hematuria. Diagnostic considerations at this time remained that of hemolytic crisis, microangiopathic hemolysis, massive transfusion reaction. Combination of massive hemoglbinuiri and hypotension pre-disposed to acute tubular insufficiensy which seems well established at the present time in that the patient is oliguric. She also remains in shock. EKG reveal sinus tachycardia. There is diffused bleeding from the GI tract, vagina, urinary tract and there are multiple superficial puncture sites.

There are alot of tests, but I don't know what they mean or how to read them. I'll list some of them and maybe you can make sense of them.

6/ 12/ 75
Hematology

TEST
WBC x 10 5 2 .6
4 7 .4 Corrected wbc

RCB 1.09
HGB 3.4
HCE 1 1.0
MVC 1 0 1
MCH 3 1.0

Myelocte 1
Metamyelocyte 1
Band 15
PMN 68
Moncyte 3
NUCL RBC (11) ( something else I can't read)

anisocytosis 3+

Polchromasia 4 +

Reticulocytes 43.0

evaluated for folic acid

results:

4.3 NG/??
4-16 NG/ml ?

Next day:
Reticulocytes 34.0

HBG 4.0
HCT 12.0

next day:

HBG 3.7
HCT 13.0

More tests: I believe urine

Color: Amber
Character: Cloudy
Reaction: 6.5
Pecific gravity 011
Alb??? 3+
Sugar neg
Hemoglobin Large
WBC/HPP ( or HFF) 10-12
RBC/HPP ( of HFF) unreadable
Crystals ( 8-10 course granulear c??)
Casts/LPF 60-70 ceblular cast???


Looks like they also gave her bone marrow.


This 41 yr old female presented to the ER complaining of headaches. Originally the pain was occipital in nature radiating to the frontal region, it became subsequently generalized at the time of admission. The pt tried bed rest for 3 days before she came to the ER. PT said that she was aking darvocat 10 #4 and Empirin with only mild relief and also there was nausea and vomiting the day before admission. The patient had a long history of migraine headaches. The pt also gave a history or anemia since the age of 12. She had several courses of b complex and b12. She also has numerous allergies. She gave a history of having some transfusions when she was going through childbirth. The pt was also taking antihistamines and allergyg shots.

The physical exam at the time of admission revealed the temp to be 97.4, pulse of 120/minute, resp. rate 24/minute, bp 144/78. The pt appeared markedly anemic, slightly obese, and severely jaundiced. The conjuctivae were pale. The sclerae were icteric. The fundi did not reveal any evidence of hemmorage, exudate, or papilledema. The neck was supple, no thyroid enlargement. There was no palpable lymphadenopathy in the cervical, axillary, or inguinal region. The thorax was essentially normal. Lungs were clear. The heart showed no evidence of ardiomegaly. There was ????? moderate tachycardia of 124/minute. The blood vessels showed the pulses were palapable in all superficial blood vessels. There was no evidence of hepatosplenomegaly. Genitourinary did not reveal any evidence of tenderness in the cardiophranic angle. Musculoskeletal did not reveal any abnormality. Extremities showed no varicosities, pitting edema or ulceration. Neurological exam was normal.

Initial workup in the ER revealed a white blood count of 23,700, red blood count was 1,550,000, hemoglobin of 5.7 gm, hematocrit of 15.9 % slightly microcytic indices, RETICULOCYTES of 17.6%, many sperocyes, jaundiced plasma. The differential showed 2 myelocytes, 1 metamyelocytes, 7 bands, 76 PMN's, 9 lymphocytes, 3 monocytes, 2 eosinophils, and 2 nucleated red blood cells. The CPK was normal. The electrolytes were within normal limits. Direct Coombs was 2+. URNINALYSIS SHOWED A SMALL AMOUNT OF HEMOGLOBIN. The total bilirubin was 7.7, direct bilirubin was 1.0. The creatinine was 0.8, SGOT of 38, LDH of 1207. Diagnosis of Coombs positive hemolytic anemia was established.


There is much more, but maybe this is enough to figure it out?
 
  9 
09-15-2004
I think we need some help here
URNINALYSIS SHOWED A SMALL AMOUNT OF HEMOGLOBIN


This is blood in urine, right?
I did notice that the Red Blood Cell count was very low.

Normal generic range of Red Blood cells for female:

4.2 to 5.4 million cells/mcl

Because men have more muscle, the regular normal range for them are for male:

4.7 to 6.1 million cells/mcl

Notice they talk about 2 nucleated red blood cells in one of the samples, those are immature red blood cells?

I notice that they were checking the reticulocyte count.

Reticulocyte Count Definition: A test that measures the percentage of reticulocytes (slightly immature red blood cells) in blood.

A special stain can be used to identify reticulocytes, because they contain remnants of RNA. Fully mature red blood cells are terminally-differentiated cells lacking nuclei and nucleic acids. The number of reticulocytes in the blood is proportional to their rate of synthesis and release by the bone marrow. The body will respond to bleeding or hemolytic anemia (breakdown of red blood cells) by an increased rate of red blood cell synthesis under normal circumstances.
I noticed on one person's hematology report that the 'retic' was normal at 0.5%-2% So is 34 a count or is that the percentage?

I only studied this chemical. . . and people known and suspected to be harmed by it. I'm not a medical person.
offdahook4now, “I found a very good site that explains reticulocytes. Sometimes they are expressed in percentages and/or whole numbers:”

www.med-ed.virginia.edu/courses/path/innes/nh/normbasics2.cfm  

If your mother died of acute autoimmune hemolytic anemia and her reticulocyte count was 34%, 31% ...
Retic, then is extremely high  #12

offdahook4now, “34 is a percent. I found another reference to reticulocytes saying they were 31.0 % on another date.”  

Ok, this is the first place that covers up the hemolytic anemia. It would be called compensated hemolytic anemia because the bone marrow 'covers' up the premature destruction of red blood cells by making more red blood cells. When doctors check the blood counts, and hemoglobin and hematocrit, they look "OK" and they don't check further.

 

Why doctors don't find the fatigue? Doctors believe that if there is significant blood hemolysis, it will show up in the blood count.

Says Patricia P. Wilcox, M.S. "Not true. There can be significant hemolysis which is invisible if all you do is a standard blood count, but shows up nicely as an elevated reticulocyte count , about 2.5 days after exposure ... This is called compensated hemolytic anemia."

According to Robbins' Pathologic Basis of Disease, 5th Edition (1994), Chapter 13 (Diseases of Red Cells and Bleeding Disorders), page 584:

"With an increased demand for blood cells in the adult, the fatty marrow may become transformed to red, active marrow. Moreover, this is accompanied by increased productive activity throughout the marrow. These adaptive changes are capable of increasing red cell production (erythropoiesis) seven- to eight-fold. Thus ... such loss of red cells as may occur in hemolytic disorders produces anemia only when the marrow compensatory mechanisms are outstripped."

So a reticulocyte count might be a good screening tool for red blood cell damage/destruction due to exposure to certain types of solvents, e.g. glycol ethers, in patients who are not so badly damaged that they can no longer replace red cells as fast as they are losing them (i.e., they still have normal red blood cell count, hemoglobin, and hematocrit).

Mark Cullen et al. looked for changes in peripheral blood and bone marrow in solvent-exposed printers and spray painters, and found substantial bone marrow abnormalities that were undetectable in peripheral blood counts -- they focused on glycol ethers as a likely suspect ...

Cullen et al. found a one-to-one correspondence between blood/bone marrow abnormalities and red blood cell pyruvate kinase (PK) deficiency in solvent-exposed workers.

... says Wilcox, "I'm not sure how well the reticulocyte count would reflect benzene exposure, which reportedly suppresses production of new red blood cells rather than simply killing existing red cells. A more usual marker of "benzene poisoning" is an abnormally low lymphocyte count"

Patricia P. Wilcox, M.S., M.P.H. (master of public health), the above quote was when she was a student at

School of Public Health
The Ohio State University

With this chemical's harm it causes a lot of other things that are very serious, and although the fatigue of CFS, CFIDS, 'gulf war syndrome' groups is this, in my opinion, based on other symptoms that go with this chemical's harm, ... the doctors say they don't know the cause of the fatigue and turn their attention to the other more serious ailments: central nervous system damage, the headaches, the bones, the joints, multiple cancers even. Everything else gets the 'credit' for harming someone. (Blood sugar will often go sky high & get 'blamed' for an acute attack of autoimmune hemolytic anemia ... or blood pressure, for instance) At this point doctors think it is the diabetes that causes kidney damage. Maybe they should look back to what caused the high blood sugar in the first place.

Does the CDC or anyone else say a death is from 2-butoxyethanol poisoning? No, the root cause is missed. But it doesn't have to be. Check every cancer group that is being studied for the percentage whose root cause is 2-butoxyethanol poisoning. Which subjects have blood in urine?? and red blood cells that are not the right ratio of mature and immature? Depending on the time since initial exposure, then what is the 'retic' ratio. If your mom had lived and never been exposed to a chemical such as this again, over time her 'retic' ratio would have dropped and dropped because the bone marrow becomes less and less able to keep up with making the new red blood cells that the body needs. Because the red blood cells may never live to be 120 days old, a person would feel fatigue: not enough mature red blood cells to carry and store the iron, the oxygen. That's my lay person's take on it.

If there comes a time when there is no blood showing in urine, but someone has had fatigue for a LONG, LONG time, then check the peripheral blood. Also those harmed by 2-butoxyethanol can have enlarged, swollen and ulcerated glands: spleen, gall bladder, pancreas .. and many times they have operations to have them removed, which is risky when someone has impaired immune system. One worker on the Exxon Valdez oil spill cleanup had many swollen glands all through his chest and testicals, too. His peripheral blood smear was abnormal about 8 years later. On the 12-27-97 death certificate it listed the following as cause of death

He was 55 years old when he died,

Caradiac Arrest/Asystole
due to e-coli Sepsis,
due to Neutropenia,
due to B-Cell Lymphoma, S/P Chemo
with significant contributing to cause of death being
Acute Renal Failure, Liver Failure

This man was a native who lived about 100 miles north of Valdez. There is also a small village of natives some miles out of Prince William Sound whose beaches were sprayed with this as well. Of the 12 elders in the village of Chenega, 9 have died in their middle years of kidney &/or liver ailments. Their beach was sprayed with the 'bioremediation' chemical concoction: Inipol EAP 22, an Exxon formulation created to 'cleanup the beaches' after the 1989 Exxon Valdez oil spill. C6H14O2/CH3(CH2)2CH2OCH2CH2OH this is the Chemical formula for 2-butoxyethanol. Studying this chemical has led me to want to learn how it harms people.

I feel so for your situation. Even when your mom was alive, she would have 'looked' OK, but been very, very ill. . . Not able to express the love she had for you, or to do things with you and for the family. (The central nervous system damage can cause a lot of rage and anger outbursts. Many people loose their jobs, their marriages; children and spouses feel alienated and don't realize that their family member is ill. I can't even imagine the burden this places on the health systems, the social services) Some people have probably gone ballistic & harmed someone else. There may be people who are incarcerated today from effects of chemical poisoning (?) ... or in the psychiatric ward (This chemical's harm mimics true psychiatric disorder).

And you feel your husband may be affected? I am so sorry to hear this. What I've noticed from families whose husband and dad is affected is that he can't nurture and care for his children and wife the way he otherwise would. It is a BIG loss to our nation. Even when he can work, he wouldn't be able to be at his best. I say, the human toll of this chemical needs to be looked into. Our human resource is our most valuable resource.

Just a quick comment on 'allergies' Many times this is not an allergy, but a body's response to too much of some kind of chemical.

I would like to restate the 'package' of hemolytic anemia symptoms AND add on symptoms (per yahoo medical definition and per research on 2-butoxyethanol):

Rapid heart beat is one sign of hemolytic anemia

Do you have a fatigue, too?

There are about 8 symptoms,

others include being pale; jaundiced; enlarged spleen; chills; shortness of breath; dark urine

With the 2-butoxyethanol over-exposure there will be all types of glandular problems (endocrine disruption) and there can be high or low blood pressure; high or low blood sugar ... showing this chemical's interference, too

There are a lot of other noticeable symptoms, such as these with the central nervous system:

Short term memory loss


Difficulty concentrating

 
Personality changes to 'grumpy' - Extreme Irritability

 
All the time Depression

 
Suicidal Tendencies

 
Difficulty sleeping

 
Some get MS

2-butoxyethanol CHRONIC EFFECTS - TARGET ORGANS, per research:


SENSE ORGANS AND SPECIAL SENSES (Other olfaction effects)
BEHAVIORAL (General Anesthetic)
BEHAVIORAL (Altered sleep time)
BEHAVIORAL (Somnolence)
BEHAVIORAL (Excitement)
BEHAVIORAL (ATAXIA)
BEHAVIORAL (Coma)
BEHAVIORAL (ANALGESIA) LUNGS, THORAX OR RESPIRATION (DYSPNAE)
LUNGS, THORAX OR RESPIRATION (Other changes)
GASTROINTESTINAL (Nasea or vomiting)
GASTROINTESTINAL (Other changes)
LIVER (Tumors)
KIDNEY, ureter, bladder (hematuria - blood in urine)
KIDNEY, ureter, bladder (other changes)
ENDOCRINE (Tumors)
SKIN AND APPENDAGES (Hair)
MATERNAL EFFECTS (uterus, cervix, vagina)
MATERNAL EFFECTS (Other effects on female)
EFFECTS ON FERTILITY (Pre-implantation mortality)
EFFECTS ON FERTILITY (Post-implantation mortality)
EFFECTS ON FERTILITY (Litter size)
SPECIFIC DEVELOPMENTAL ABNORMALITIES (Musculoskeletal system)
SPECIFIC DEVELOPMENTAL ABNORMALITIES (Cardiovascular system)
NUTRITIONAL AND GROSS METABOLIC (Weight loss or decreased weight gain)
NUTRITIONAL AND GROSS METABOLIC (Changes in: metabolic acidosis)
TUMORIGENIC (Carcinogenic by RTECS criteria)
TUMORIGENIC (Equivocal tumorigenic agent by RTECS criteria)

                              Doctors can get more information

                    www.valdezlink.com/generic.htm#research

Many times on products which contain 2-butoxyethanol, you will note the warning, "defats the skin" Maybe that is why there are so many joint problems, and neurological problems ... defating the insulators around nerve endings; defating the join cartilage?  Mother_Margaret@yahoo.com
#13 

We always knew my mom was ill most of the time. Besides that, she had 5 children of her own, and 4 step-children she took care of. I went through her complete medical history, from the time she was pregnant in 57 with my sister until she died.

She went to the dr. a lot and some of her major complaints were : chest pains, shoulder pain, pain in the legs, shortness of breath, confusion, fatigue, congestion due to hay fever and allergies. She also mentioned tightness in chest and most of all headaches.
These symptoms occurred 3 yrs before she died. How long before she died would she have been exposed to this chemical? I'm trying real hard to think about her activities, but am coming up blank.

Is it possible that she passed something on to me? Here is the thread I started in the GWS telling of my symptoms, and my husbands.

oops... forgot to add the url
healthboards.com/boards/showthread.php?t=207800


I can totally relate to the symptoms you mention, except I have no suicidal tendencies. I don't know about MS, but my half sister has this. Different mother, same father.

Short term memory loss
Difficulty concentrating
Personality changes to 'grumpy' - Extreme Irritability
All the time Depression
Suicidal Tendencies
Difficulty sleeping
Some get MS


I think I'm getting more confused the more I read. :-(

#14
some autopsy findings
Autopsy report mentions spleen markedly enlarged weighing 425 grams. Says:
The aplenic capsule appears smooth and pale pink-purple. On cut section the cut surface appears deep red and the spleen is soft and mushy, this represents acute congestive splennomegaly.

I noticed on all these copies I have, someone put X marks in the marigins to indicate interest. Spleen was one of them, Bone marrow is another and kidneys:

Bone Marrow: Sections of bone marrow showed a marked degree of erythroid hyperplasia. Very little fat is present in the marrow. Numbers of megakeryocytes are normal. The cells of the erythrocytic series are diffusely and markedly increased.

KIDNEYS:
The renal tubules stain poorly, apparently a combination of autolysis and perhaps necrotic changes as well. There is also a suggestion of sloughing of renal tubular apithelium. The glomeruli stain poorly and appear to be autolyzed. Thrombi within glomeruler capillaries cannot be recognized. Small hemorrhages can be seen in the peripelvic adipose tissues. One section of kidney shows what apparently represents extensive necrosis of the renal cortex. In the areas of extensive necrosis groups of colonies of organisms can be seen here and there.
#15

All of this is very valuable information and important for people to take note of. Many times the harm of 2-butoxyethanol's secondary symptoms are all that are noted ... such as the native man I just shared on. He had to have the same autoimmune hemolytic anemia underlying these problems, but did his doctor's find it? Maybe there will be something in his early blood work or urinalysis that will say?

You are doing VERY, VERY well to make so much sense out of what I'm sharing and the medical information on your mother. The spleen being enlarged, as you will note, is also one of the signs of hemolytic anemia.

People need to look at the BIG PICTURE and in this day and age of so many specialists, something may be getting lost. A gulf war vet just shared that he paid $182 to get CBCs with differentials and a urinalysis and was not given a copy of the medical results even after asking the lab for a copy. I think he also said that the doctor was no longer available ... moved or something ... and the lab said that there were new rules and they were prevented from giving him a copy of his own lab tests. How very sad. This must not be the case; and if it is, we must lobby our Congress to change it!

Now, one more question, Did your mother exhibit any fatigue or related symptoms PRIOR to getting a blood transfusion? I do wonder whether people with Chronic Fatigue could donate blood, and then the altered immune dysfunction is passed along to someone through a blood transfusion. This is a scary thought. But I have wondered about it.

As to you, I'll read your other post for symptoms, but do you know when they started? It is possible to inherit ailments from a parent who is damaged ...as this chemical is a teratogen: it harms the developing fetus.

However, second hand exposure is very real; and so is being exposed directly to this chemical. It is in so many things! I would estimate that there is a lot less hereditary harm ... that diseases run in families as doctors suppose ... and that it is more damage from chemicals either directly, from a parent, or by getting vapors into one's eyes from a spouse or other close association.

One parent of a bioremediation worker of the Exxon Valdez oil spill cleanup found out that her son had 3 friends he shared a college dorm room with. And knowing the potential harm of this chemical from second hand exposure (those rooms are pretty small) and the strong exposure her son had, she is starting to contact the parents of the other 3 boys. If they were affected, they would have NO IDEA what had harmed them. That they were second-handedly exposed to 2-butoxyethanol.
#16

Records say she had anemia since she was 12 yr old. That would cause fatigue. She had the 1st blood transfusion when she was apx 23 yrs old during childbirth. I don't know anything about this time period.

I do know that when I was a kid as far back as I can remember, she was always fatigued. (raising 9 kids could make anyone fatigued though.) Always had bad headaches, and bad allergies.

I never saw my mother in the hospital before she died. ( after her blood transfusions) My brother and I were too young to be admitted into ICU to see her. I have all of the blood transfusion records, and it looks like there were a lot of units of blood ( 10 or more) she rec'd. I don't' know how many transfusions.

I was mistaken about how many days she was in the hospital. She was actually in for 6 days. I was also wrong on the number of cardiac arrests. She had 4 and the 4th one was the last.

I'm going to ask my sister if she can remember my mom being exposed to any chemicals.

One more thing: my husband used to be a frequent blood donor. If I remember correctly, after the gulf war, they would not accept his blood.
This was an acute attack   #17
There are other kinds of fatigue, by the way. What your mom had as a girl could have been another kind of fatigue that doctors could identify and help her with.

However, the fatigue of a chemical such as 2-butoxyethanol is the type of fatigue, I believe, that they don't generally notice because the blood counts basically look OK.

Note that when your mom had her acute attack of autoimmune hemolytic anemia that took her life ... there were very high 'retic' counts? That's because the bone marrow was compensating as best it could ... still the Red Blood Cell count was way, low also.

One worker of our Exxon Valdez oil spill cleanup came across some of the 2-butoxyethanol unexpectedly and he said he had blood in his urine 15 minutes later.

So, please don't think that what your mom had was necessarily the same thing ...nor that it slowly progresses to this extreme point. Does anyone know what she was doing THAT DAY?

What I am saying is that this can happen to anyone in our nation even TODAY. It is not just a long ago problem. Problem is ... it is still an unrecognized problem.

So for sure, study up on what this 2-butoxyethanol is in and use with extreme caution.

Did anyone hear your mom exclaim that her eyes were burning and hurting and her commenting on when her urine turned dark and how very, very, very tired she felt??? ... on that day of her acute attack of autoimmune hemolytic anemia?

On the other hand, because she had complained of the headaches, and other CFS, CFIDS, ...& symptoms such as the 'gulf war syndrome' symptoms ... it is most probable that she had this type of anemia for awhile prior... but that a new exposure to a chemical such as ethylene glycol monobutyl ether ... or that very chemical ... was going on just before she was admitted to the hospital in 1975.

Margaret

There are web pages out there that can help you.

 
#18

Maggie,

I just want to say thanks to you for taking the time to educated me a little on this. It is possible my mother was exposed by using some kind of household cleaner, or even paint thinner, or something like that. She was a strong willed, stubborn woman....sometimes to the point that it was not good. She never once asked for help from her parents or anyone. Because of this, she did a lot of things she should have had someone else do... such as, she moved the kitchen sink from one side of the kitchen to another, by herself. She did car repairs, household repairs, etc. which might have exposed her to something. It wasn't because we were poor ( and we were poor!), it was because she had too much pride to ask someone for help. She did what she had to do.

Her death and then the murder of my father 7 yrs later had a severe effect on me. I knew the name of the disease my mom died from, just as I knew my dad had been murdered, but my mothers death has always been a mystery to me, as my fathers unsolved murder. I really do want to thank you for trying to help me with this. We had no idea what caused it, and no one was forthcoming with any answers. The most they could tell us that this was not hereditary.
#19

You have helped me more than you know. I knew some things about this autoimmune hemolytic anemia and as I said, "I suspect it as being the fatigue of CFS, CFIDS, and 'gulf war syndrome' that doctors say they don't know."

I suspect it because the chemical known to cause this anemia, reacts this way when someone has too much exposure, AND it has the other odd symptoms that the 'syndromes' state. AND it is in common use and has been for more than the past half century.

I didn't know what numbers would be checked out for someone known to have this condition. . . Or how they might read, So, again, I thank you!

I suspect a navy man from WWII who was a Fire Control Technician ... in charge of how the big navy ship guns were cleaned ... may have been a victim. If his family could get his medical file, as you have your mom's, maybe there would be similarities. By the way, do you know whether you mom had blood in her urine in prior doctor exams???

Anyway, with this man he became violent when he hadn't been & couldn't stand the sound of his new baby crying ... Later at age 62 he died of a 'heart attack' but harm to the cardiovascular system is part of what this chemical does. Maybe he had rapid heart rate & his heart gave out?

I have more questions than answers, but I believe the harm of this chemical is provable, and I think we, together, are close to figuring it out. We need others with the 'symptoms' to say yeah, or nay as to blood in urine and red blood cells that are immature ... the wrong ratio of mature to immature, their size and their shape ... & how their membranes are doing. ... and has the retic ratio been checked early on when fatigue first happened? (I wonder how long the retic ratio will be abnormally elevated)

Now, this health ailment is not a disease. This is a response to a chemical. Over exposure to a chemical and being chemically poisoned are synonymous. Most of the time it isn't this severe and really does go undiagnosed in most people. How common is CFS? ... CFIDS? .... & the 'gulf war syndrome' symptoms in our general population? It is as common as that. It's the hard workers like your mom and your husband who run in to it the most ... what a loss to our nation!

I suspect it is in the solvent in weapon cleaning compounds, and is in paint, and in varnishes. It is used in oil spill cleanup compounds (sadly, as it does no good) and in multiple products you use at home for cleaning and degreasing. It is in 409 cleaner, and the complex version, labeled as a pesticide by EPA, in Lysol Tub 'n Tile. It is in glass cleaner, oven cleaner, spot removal products, automotive products, hobby products, home maintenance and landscaping products. Some people think it is in jet fuel.

Check for what products contain 2-butoxyethanol (CAS Registry Number: 000111-76-2) in the Household Products Data Base http://hpd.nlm.nih.gov/ingredients.htm or check on the internet.

Also check for the complex version Diethylene glycol monobutyl ether or 2-2-butoxyethanol (CAS Registry Number: 000112-34-5) 5% concentration is not safe for home use, per one expert in product development.

People do not take the warnings seriously, but they should. Wear goggles and chemical retardant gloves and have ventilation equivalent to outdoors. On the other hand, most of the time the ingredient is NOT disclosed and you have to know what type of warnings might indicate such. Something really needs to change here. A clean bathtub is not worth someone's life. The price we are paying is NOT worth the benefit received. It is an unnecessary harm.

 

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9-18-04